Microsoft Dynamics NAV 2009 - Marketing Beta released

2

Comments

  • DenSterDenSter Posts: 8,121Member
    I believe you can still use native database server, but you won't be able to run pages. You'd also have to privide functionality in both pages and forms, and make sure that it is the same from either place.

    A customer that sees a form like that as a must have priority will not be able to run the RTC. You have to be able to be flexible and be willing to look at alternatives, such as factboxes. This new version has no room for black/white type people, you must be willing to consider alternatives. For every thing that is "wrong" there are many more things that are "right" in return.

    You can also promote certain fields onto the fast-tabs, so that minimized fast-tabs don't just take up space. For instance you can have an Invoicing fast-tab with the bill-to customer name, their contact and their phone number promote, and you will see that even when the fast-tab is minimized.
  • DenSterDenSter Posts: 8,121Member
    BlackTiger wrote:
    (sort of sad joke) Can I have THIS on NAV RT Client?
    2904510856_fd449b7d8d.jpg?v=0
    http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3226/2904510856_a001097516_o.jpg
    What's the sad joke, that a form like that can't be created as a page in NAV2009, or that the form is like that in the first place? :mrgreen:

    All kidding aside though... no you can't create a page that looks like that, and I also think it is a big mistake not to have wysiwyg UI design in NAV2009. What I DO think though, is that there are many alternatives, that might also work. You have to be willing to consider the alternatives. Don't just create a page and dismiss it right off the bat because you can't make it look a certain way. Try to make it work, try to provide the same functionality, and make the customer happy. Figure out every factbox type, and see if you can use them for your customer. Right now you probably don't know more than 10% of what pages are capable of, and I think you could be more positive about it. You've already said you like it, now try to make it work for your customers. I agree that it would be nice to have wysiwyg UI design, but it isn't there, so I have to deal with it, and I've moved on from there years ago. This metadata based UI has so many more capabilities.

    Of course if the customer is not willing to listen then the story doesn't work. BUT a failed implementation is then not because NAV2009 can't provide this customer's functionality, it's because the customer doesn't want to listen to alternatives, and for a customer like that it might be better to use a different product, or not to upgrade.
  • BeliasBelias Posts: 2,993Member
    is there a way to mark some lines in pages?
    like ctrl+f1 in the classic client :-k
    -Mirko-
    "Never memorize what you can easily find in a book".....Or Mibuso
    My Blog
  • jreynoldsjreynolds Posts: 172Member
    Belias wrote:
    is there a way to mark some lines in pages?
    like ctrl+f1 in the classic client :-k

    Marking is not supported in the RTC.
  • jreynoldsjreynolds Posts: 172Member
    I’ve been working with pages for several months now and while I miss many of the things that were possible with forms I’m starting to learn about and appreciate some of the new things that can be done with pages. My biggest frustration has been the enormous amount of time required to learn how to develop pages. With forms we have had a number of techniques available to us.
      - The Application Designer’s Guide contains several sections on forms. - There are instructor led and self study courses available for developers. - Help exists for all of the controls, properties, and triggers available for forms. - Online communities like MIBUSO where questions can be asked and seen (and answered) by hundreds of experienced developers around the world. - Study and examine the forms that are in the system. - Testing and experimentation with form controls, properties, and triggers.

    Unfortunately for pages these have been severely limited or are non-existent although that is starting to change somewhat.
      - The Application Designer's Guide is being delivered as a help file and is starting to include information on pages but it is still very much a work in progress: - There are no instructor led or self study courses that I am aware of. - Help is starting to be delivered for controls and properties, but like the ADG it is still a work in progress. - Prior to the release of the marketing beta we were bound by NDA's to avoid discussing these topics in forums like MIBUSO. - Studying the existing pages is possible. However, since all of the pages have been created by a transformation process of forms into pages, the existing pages do not exploit all of the capabilities of pages. - Testing and experimentation with pages is possible but this is made difficult by the lack of documentation and the fact that a debugger for pages does not exist. (
    I really miss a debugger!)

    I imagine that documentation will continue to trickle out and some of the blogs that are coming out of MS are very helpful. However, my biggest hope is that with the lifting of the NDAs that the on-line forums will now start to become a place where we can really accelerate our learning.
  • clauslclausl Posts: 455Member
    BlackTiger wrote:
    Look. Here is how maximized(!) Sales Order entry form looks on 1280x800:
    2906228843_3f0d75694d.jpg?v=0
    http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3218/2906228843_8a5ca0c04c_o.jpg

    1. No way to resize "Lines" section.
    2. No way to navigate between "tabs" without a mouse (forget about standard "Ctrl+PgDn/Ctrl+PgUp" combinations).
    3. Many areas are not accessible by keyboard.

    Also just compare areas used by "old fashioned" TabControl's "labels" and the new "cool one". No... unfortunately UI is not MS' strongest side...

    And "The Ribbon"... Such a wasting of space... Yes, it looks nice, but... completely useless in terms of screen space optimization. BTW, how to change ribbon's colour? Where is "big button" like I can see in Excel and Word?

    So don't forget to include minimum monitor resolution 1280x1024 in hardware specs.


    1.To make more room for the Lines FastTab I would recommend setting the property "Importance=Additional" on some of fields on the General FastTab. This is done in either Page Designer by the Partner or by the End-user in Personalization . The idea behind this setting is that fields with "Importance=Additional" are not crucial for the users daily work, but can easily be access by the user by clicking "Show more fields" in the bottom right corner of the Generals FastTab.

    2. You can navigate between FastTabs with F6 and SHIFT+F6.

    3. One ShortCut I really like is the CRTL+F10, this gives you access to the Action Pane and you press either 1,2 or 3 ex. on the Customer Card to get into either New, Process or Reports.
    But you can ready more about the ShortCuts in NAV 2009 and how the map from the Classic client in the "nav_adg.chm" on the Product DVD. Search for "ShortCuts" ;-)
    Claus Lundstrøm | MVP | Senior Product Manager | Continia.com
    I'm blogging here:http://mibuso.com/blogs/clausl and used to blog here: http://blogs.msdn.com/nav
    I'm also offering RDLC Report Training, ping me if you are interested. Thanks to the 700 NAV developers that have now already been at my training. You know you can always call if you have any RDLC report issues :-)
  • BeliasBelias Posts: 2,993Member
    Try this:
    -open a sales order (in view or edit mode)
    -click on "show me more fields" (or show "me less fields") action near the collapse/expand button of the opened "general" fast tab
    -collapse the fast tab ---it's completely white!---
    -recollapse the fast tab or click "show me..." to get it right.

    (you need at least a field on the fast tab with "additional" importance, in order to have the action button visible)
    every card page do this, not only the sales order...
    :bug: ?
    -Mirko-
    "Never memorize what you can easily find in a book".....Or Mibuso
    My Blog
  • clauslclausl Posts: 455Member
    jreynolds wrote:
    I’ve been working with pages for several months now and while I miss many of the things that were possible with forms I’m starting to learn about and appreciate some of the new things that can be done with pages. My biggest frustration has been the enormous amount of time required to learn how to develop pages. With forms we have had a number of techniques available to us.
      - The Application Designer’s Guide contains several sections on forms. - There are instructor led and self study courses available for developers. - Help exists for all of the controls, properties, and triggers available for forms. - Online communities like MIBUSO where questions can be asked and seen (and answered) by hundreds of experienced developers around the world. - Study and examine the forms that are in the system. - Testing and experimentation with form controls, properties, and triggers.

    Unfortunately for pages these have been severely limited or are non-existent although that is starting to change somewhat.
      - The Application Designer's Guide is being delivered as a help file and is starting to include information on pages but it is still very much a work in progress: - There are no instructor led or self study courses that I am aware of. - Help is starting to be delivered for controls and properties, but like the ADG it is still a work in progress. - Prior to the release of the marketing beta we were bound by NDA's to avoid discussing these topics in forums like MIBUSO. - Studying the existing pages is possible. However, since all of the pages have been created by a transformation process of forms into pages, the existing pages do not exploit all of the capabilities of pages. - Testing and experimentation with pages is possible but this is made difficult by the lack of documentation and the fact that a debugger for pages does not exist. (
    I really miss a debugger!)

    I imagine that documentation will continue to trickle out and some of the blogs that are coming out of MS are very helpful. However, my biggest hope is that with the lifting of the NDAs that the on-line forums will now start to become a place where we can really accelerate our learning.

    One correction we have debugger for NAV 2009, just don't think anybody have talked about this yet. Maybe this would be a good topic for my next Blog post?
    Claus Lundstrøm | MVP | Senior Product Manager | Continia.com
    I'm blogging here:http://mibuso.com/blogs/clausl and used to blog here: http://blogs.msdn.com/nav
    I'm also offering RDLC Report Training, ping me if you are interested. Thanks to the 700 NAV developers that have now already been at my training. You know you can always call if you have any RDLC report issues :-)
  • BlackTigerBlackTiger Posts: 1,211Member
    No "marked only" mode?!?!? It... I don't like it. Definitely...

    My company has quite a lot of forms based on "marked" records (same problem with "editable" matrixes, btw).
    It's not always possible to apply simple "AND"-criteria. Even non-existent "OR" will not help. Sometimes "criteria" is a "f(n)".

    What about methods like "GetSelectionFilter() : Code[80]" from Form18?...

    Eah... I don't like it again... "New" not always a "step forward"... :-k
    "You can’t just ask customers what they want and then try to give that to them.
    By the time you get it built, they’ll want something new.” Steve Jobs
  • WaldoWaldo Posts: 3,412Member
    clausl wrote:
    jreynolds wrote:
    I’ve been working with pages for several months now and while I miss many of the things that were possible with forms I’m starting to learn about and appreciate some of the new things that can be done with pages. My biggest frustration has been the enormous amount of time required to learn how to develop pages. With forms we have had a number of techniques available to us.
      - The Application Designer’s Guide contains several sections on forms. - There are instructor led and self study courses available for developers. - Help exists for all of the controls, properties, and triggers available for forms. - Online communities like MIBUSO where questions can be asked and seen (and answered) by hundreds of experienced developers around the world. - Study and examine the forms that are in the system. - Testing and experimentation with form controls, properties, and triggers.

    Unfortunately for pages these have been severely limited or are non-existent although that is starting to change somewhat.
      - The Application Designer's Guide is being delivered as a help file and is starting to include information on pages but it is still very much a work in progress: - There are no instructor led or self study courses that I am aware of. - Help is starting to be delivered for controls and properties, but like the ADG it is still a work in progress. - Prior to the release of the marketing beta we were bound by NDA's to avoid discussing these topics in forums like MIBUSO. - Studying the existing pages is possible. However, since all of the pages have been created by a transformation process of forms into pages, the existing pages do not exploit all of the capabilities of pages. - Testing and experimentation with pages is possible but this is made difficult by the lack of documentation and the fact that a debugger for pages does not exist. (
    I really miss a debugger!)

    I imagine that documentation will continue to trickle out and some of the blogs that are coming out of MS are very helpful. However, my biggest hope is that with the lifting of the NDAs that the on-line forums will now start to become a place where we can really accelerate our learning.

    One correction we have debugger for NAV 2009, just don't think anybody have talked about this yet. Maybe this would be a good topic for my next Blog post?
    Yes please :)

    Eric Wauters
    MVP - Microsoft Dynamics NAV
    My blog
  • gvolkovgvolkov Posts: 196Member
    how did you start the RTC? i am trying to start it with default server name 'localhost/DynamicsNAV' but it says nothing found.
    Microsoft Certified Technology Specialist
    Microsoft Certified Business Management Solutions Professional
    Microsoft Certified Business Management Solutions Specialist
    http://www.navisiontech.com
  • p.willemse6p.willemse6 Posts: 216Member
    edited 2008-10-02
    We've been in te TAP program for a while now, and have been working on a customer site with NAV 2009. I can tell you that every eomployee of our company wanted and still wants to be part of this team. They keep becoming more enthousiastic about the different possiblities of the new client. But, you have to be open minded to change your way of work at some points. It seems that at least one of our co-posters does not seem to do so, although I see a little difference in the last post....

    The screen above were like the screens we built back in the year 2000 at NAV 2.60. There are many possibilities to set up different screens, and design a more efficient way to work...
  • BlackTigerBlackTiger Posts: 1,211Member
    gvolkov wrote:
    how did you start the RTC? i am trying to start it with default server name 'localhost/DynamicsNAV' but it says nothing found.

    Restart the server inside VPC. Or start NAV's service. Sometimes service unable to start properly.
    Also it's better to disable "undo disk" for VPC image.
    "You can’t just ask customers what they want and then try to give that to them.
    By the time you get it built, they’ll want something new.” Steve Jobs
  • wwestendorpwwestendorp Posts: 178Member
    I see in some client roles nice charts.
    How can I create a new chart and how to add them to that chart list? Via MS Visual Studio and save as ???
  • BlackTigerBlackTiger Posts: 1,211Member
    BTW, which license allows to edit and create "zee page"?
    "You can’t just ask customers what they want and then try to give that to them.
    By the time you get it built, they’ll want something new.” Steve Jobs
  • BeliasBelias Posts: 2,993Member
    i have 2 dev licenses, both valid. (one has recently been refreshed because of a new add-on of our company).
    well...the older works and the new one does not. :-k
    -Mirko-
    "Never memorize what you can easily find in a book".....Or Mibuso
    My Blog
  • BlackTigerBlackTiger Posts: 1,211Member
    I've used our current dev license in previously released VPC without any problems.
    And same license doesn't work for "MarketingBeta"...
    "You can’t just ask customers what they want and then try to give that to them.
    By the time you get it built, they’ll want something new.” Steve Jobs
  • wwestendorpwwestendorp Posts: 178Member
    The same here.
    I requesed a new license via CLT, lets wait if the new license allows me to creeate new pages.
    Currently with my 5.1 developer licens it is not possible.
  • BlackTigerBlackTiger Posts: 1,211Member
    Question... What is full proper URL to access NAV2009's web-services?
    "You can’t just ask customers what they want and then try to give that to them.
    By the time you get it built, they’ll want something new.” Steve Jobs
  • ara3nara3n Posts: 9,229Member
    Ahmed Rashed Amini
    Independent Consultant/Developer


    blog: https://dynamicsuser.net/nav/b/ara3n
  • BlackTigerBlackTiger Posts: 1,211Member
    Grrrr.... A point! "point" in company name!!! ](*,)
    "You can’t just ask customers what they want and then try to give that to them.
    By the time you get it built, they’ll want something new.” Steve Jobs
  • philippegirodphilippegirod Posts: 190Member
    And for Clients (user of Navision) is there a way to download this release ?
    (Our NSC refuse to provide us, as they refused to provide us the 5.0 version. I think they don't even know how to obtain it).
    My candle burns by both ends, it will not last the night,
    But oh my foes and oh my friends, it gives a lovely light
  • BeliasBelias Posts: 2,993Member
    no, customers can't obtain marketing beta release...
    why?
    1. it is a beta release, which means it is not the final version, so there can be bugs and/or lackness of features
    2. it is for partners only, in order to show the product to customers for marketing purpose and learn the new features (that are a lot)
    -Mirko-
    "Never memorize what you can easily find in a book".....Or Mibuso
    My Blog
  • BlackTigerBlackTiger Posts: 1,211Member
    IMHO, not quite correct. It's "MarketingBeta". So, by my understanding, "customers" can't download and use it, but NSC can demonstrate NAV2009 features to some customers.
    Correct me if I'm wrong.
    "You can’t just ask customers what they want and then try to give that to them.
    By the time you get it built, they’ll want something new.” Steve Jobs
  • BlackTigerBlackTiger Posts: 1,211Member
    BlackTiger wrote:
    Grrrr.... A point! "point" in company name!!! ](*,)

    BTW... What if company name contains national characters? :-k
    "You can’t just ask customers what they want and then try to give that to them.
    By the time you get it built, they’ll want something new.” Steve Jobs
  • BeliasBelias Posts: 2,993Member
    BlackTiger wrote:
    IMHO, not quite correct. It's "MarketingBeta". So, by my understanding, "customers" can't download and use it, but NSC can demonstrate NAV2009 features to some customers.
    Correct me if I'm wrong.
    you're correct, but the initial question was
    And for Clients (user of Navision) is there a way to download this release ?
    :mrgreen:
    anyway...
    BTW... What if company name contains national characters?
    i was thinking...do I have to restart my pc, if i want to see pages in cyrillic (for example)?
    In the classic client, we must do it in order to acces db...but with pages?
    and as you say, how can we type the company name without the right characters?copy and paste symbols from word? :shock:
    -Mirko-
    "Never memorize what you can easily find in a book".....Or Mibuso
    My Blog
  • BlackTigerBlackTiger Posts: 1,211Member
    Find :bug: in 60 seconds:
    2925894687_96a8a40ac7.jpg?v=0
    http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3001/2925894687_8815c3937e_o.jpg

    Dear Microsoft... I know, I'm bloody annoying bas*rd, I'm not singing hymns to Microsoft... But.. please... hire me! [-o<
    I just can't be calm watching at such things and having no ability to do anything...
    You will lose nothing by hiring me.

    PS: Hmmm... But Microsoft has no office in Edinburgh... I want to stay in Edinburgh, I love this city... I hate crossroads...
    "You can’t just ask customers what they want and then try to give that to them.
    By the time you get it built, they’ll want something new.” Steve Jobs
  • DenSterDenSter Posts: 8,121Member
    BlackTiger wrote:
    I want to stay in Edinburgh, I love this city... I hate crossroads...
    Yeah Edinburgh is cool, been there a couple of times, lots of roundabouts *scottish accent*
  • BlackTigerBlackTiger Posts: 1,211Member
    edited 2008-10-09
    DenSter wrote:
    BlackTiger wrote:
    I want to stay in Edinburgh, I love this city... I hate crossroads...
    Yeah Edinburgh is cool, been there a couple of times, lots of roundabouts *scottish accent*

    No, no! Under "crossroads" I mean "decision making" process like stone with following text
    - go to the left and lose your horse
    - go to the right and lose your live
    - go forward and hit a stone by your stupid head

    PS: Scottish accent... Each planet has Scotland... :)
    "You can’t just ask customers what they want and then try to give that to them.
    By the time you get it built, they’ll want something new.” Steve Jobs
  • BlackTigerBlackTiger Posts: 1,211Member
    edited 2008-10-09
    (removed by me)
    "You can’t just ask customers what they want and then try to give that to them.
    By the time you get it built, they’ll want something new.” Steve Jobs
Sign In or Register to comment.