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Navision fully web based ?

nishlnishl Member Posts: 8
edited 2006-12-06 in NAV Three Tier
Anyone is aware or know any issues if there exist a version of navision which is FULLY web based ?

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    ara3nara3n Member Posts: 9,256
    I don't I understand your question. You are asking if there is any issue of navision version that is fully web based?

    Well none of Navision version are web based, So there aren't any issues. :mrgreen:
    Ahmed Rashed Amini
    Independent Consultant/Developer


    blog: https://dynamicsuser.net/nav/b/ara3n
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    Alex_ChowAlex_Chow Member Posts: 5,063
    The only thing that comes close to having a web based Navision is the Employee Portal.
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    ara3nara3n Member Posts: 9,256
    Also there are addons, such as sriptserver (TradePoint), which is a good solution.
    Ahmed Rashed Amini
    Independent Consultant/Developer


    blog: https://dynamicsuser.net/nav/b/ara3n
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    Alex_ChowAlex_Chow Member Posts: 5,063
    ara3n wrote:
    Also there are addons, such as sriptserver (TradePoint), which is a good solution.

    Well, I meant out of the box Navision.

    Strictly speaking, if you use Citrix, it's also "Navision on the web"
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    ara3nara3n Member Posts: 9,256
    deadlizard wrote:
    ara3n wrote:
    Also there are addons, such as sriptserver (TradePoint), which is a good solution.

    Well, I meant out of the box Navision.

    Strictly speaking, if you use Citrix, it's also "Navision on the web"

    would you call that a 3 tierd system?
    Ahmed Rashed Amini
    Independent Consultant/Developer


    blog: https://dynamicsuser.net/nav/b/ara3n
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    WaldoWaldo Member Posts: 3,412
    Well, I meant out of the box Navision.

    Strictly speaking, if you use Citrix, it's also "Navision on the web"

    Ever heard of "Jetro". Lately, it is all we recommend to our customers when they ask for "server based computing". It is much cheaper than citrix, and about the same possibilities (compatible with ICA an TS protocol).

    Eric Wauters
    MVP - Microsoft Dynamics NAV
    My blog
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    Alex_ChowAlex_Chow Member Posts: 5,063
    ara3n wrote:
    deadlizard wrote:
    ara3n wrote:
    Also there are addons, such as sriptserver (TradePoint), which is a good solution.

    Well, I meant out of the box Navision.

    Strictly speaking, if you use Citrix, it's also "Navision on the web"

    would you call that a 3 tierd system?

    :?: :?: :?:
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    Alex_ChowAlex_Chow Member Posts: 5,063
    Waldo wrote:
    Ever heard of "Jetro". Lately, it is all we recommend to our customers when they ask for "server based computing". It is much cheaper than citrix, and about the same possibilities (compatible with ICA an TS protocol).

    Can you post the link? Google comes up with Japan External Trade Organization (JETRO).
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    WaldoWaldo Member Posts: 3,412

    Eric Wauters
    MVP - Microsoft Dynamics NAV
    My blog
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    David_SingletonDavid_Singleton Member Posts: 5,479
    ara3n wrote:
    deadlizard wrote:

    ...

    Strictly speaking, if you use Citrix, it's also "Navision on the web"

    would you call that a 3 tierd system?

    Yes if you run Navision on Citrix you are running a 3 tiered system.

    Tier 1 = Database Server
    Tier 2= Dataprocessing
    Tier 3 = Client
    David Singleton
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    WaldoWaldo Member Posts: 3,412
    hm, I don't fully agree, actually.

    Isn't it:
    Tier 1: Database
    Tier 2: Fat client
    Tier 3: Remote system, using that same fat client on Tier 2

    For me, Tier 3 is just an extension for Tier 2...

    Enfin, it's just a matter of interpretation :-#

    Eric Wauters
    MVP - Microsoft Dynamics NAV
    My blog
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    David_SingletonDavid_Singleton Member Posts: 5,479
    Basically the principle is based on unix. When Sun started with distributed processing, the idea was that you could have some of your processing off loaded fromt he server to allow more CPU time for server processing, thus you had a second "server" that really was doing the non database part of the server tasks. So what we have is

    Tier 1: a Database server which has the task of getting data to and from the hard disks. This server has no idea what the data is for it just know that it has to store it and later recall it. Although this machine may process the data, it will be generic processing, there will not be any business logic processing.

    Tier 2: this is where all the business logic is processed. No data is stored here, it is just requested formt he server, business logic is applied and data is sent back. NAS is also a tier 2 application.

    Tier 3: this is just the user interface, its a screen keyboard mouse etc. It could be a web browser with some html that allows user input or it could be a client that interprets screen shots and mouse movements etc, and send these to the tier 2 machine. It could also be a GUI desigend specifically for this purpose as we will see in 5.

    I really don't knwo what the correct terminology is, I just know what each level is supposed to do. In a clasic unix environment Tiers 1 and 2 are on the same machine, tier 3 could be the dumb terminal. In a Client server environment, Tiers 2 and 3 run ont he same machine. In a citrix environment you seperate the GUI and the business logic parts.

    Sure you can get semantical on terminology, but generally I agree with Ahmed that Citrix is a 3 Tier system.
    David Singleton
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    WaldoWaldo Member Posts: 3,412
    Like I said ... it's just a matter of interpretation...

    :)

    Eric Wauters
    MVP - Microsoft Dynamics NAV
    My blog
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    ara3nara3n Member Posts: 9,256
    One thing that nobody talked about is whether the 3 tierd version of navision will need citrix? Will the bandwidth be smaller than citrix or higher?
    Ahmed Rashed Amini
    Independent Consultant/Developer


    blog: https://dynamicsuser.net/nav/b/ara3n
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    WaldoWaldo Member Posts: 3,412
    All I know it's going to be a "thin" client. Business logic is executed on IIS server.

    Bandwidth? I don't know, but I do think it's not the intention of Microsoft to deploy to internet...

    Eric Wauters
    MVP - Microsoft Dynamics NAV
    My blog
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    David_SingletonDavid_Singleton Member Posts: 5,479
    ara3n wrote:
    One thing that nobody talked about is whether the 3 tierd version of navision will need citrix? Will the bandwidth be smaller than citrix or higher?

    No you wont need citrix, basically the third tier will replace citrix for many customers.
    David Singleton
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    WaldoWaldo Member Posts: 3,412
    You sound so confident about that... .

    I rather think of an "intranet"-like implementation of the IIS. You think that I will be able to open a thin client in Belgium, and connect to the IIS (2nd tier) in the US?

    It would be nice, but I see some security issues rising up...

    Eric Wauters
    MVP - Microsoft Dynamics NAV
    My blog
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    David_SingletonDavid_Singleton Member Posts: 5,479
    Waldo wrote:
    ...
    I rather think of an "intranet"-like implementation of the IIS. You think that I will be able to open a thin client in Belgium, and connect to the IIS (2nd tier) in the US?

    ...

    Obviously you would need a VPN, but there would be little point in three tier, if it is not built as a thin client (we have more than enough processing power on our desktops, so that issue is no longer relevant), so Bandwidth should not be an issue, and since it is optomized for NAV, it should use even less bandwidth than Citrix or Terminal server.
    David Singleton
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    WaldoWaldo Member Posts: 3,412
    VPN ... I fully agree. Didn't think of that :oops:

    Eric Wauters
    MVP - Microsoft Dynamics NAV
    My blog
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    DenSterDenSter Member Posts: 8,304
    No you wont need citrix, basically the third tier will replace citrix for many customers.
    I must have missed the part where Microsoft explained that we will not need Citrix.....

    What do you base this statement on?
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    kinekine Member Posts: 12,562
    Today on Convergence EMEA on partner session they told that the new client is still full, rich client, not sort of "thin" client. But of course, because the data processing is on the service tier, the bandwidth will be much smaller.
    Kamil Sacek
    MVP - Dynamics NAV
    My BLOG
    NAVERTICA a.s.
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    Alex_ChowAlex_Chow Member Posts: 5,063
    It's all just speculation and rumors right now. But the 3 tier setup allows us to possibly have web based Navision.
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    kinekine Member Posts: 12,562
    Yes, of course, it is just about the thing that the client is not IE with some page, but full .exe application with some specialities. But of course the webservices can be used as you wish. It is just about the definition of "thin client" and "rich client".
    Kamil Sacek
    MVP - Dynamics NAV
    My BLOG
    NAVERTICA a.s.
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    mfabianmfabian Member Posts: 187
    Imagine this:
    A pure non-microsoft environment in a company. The only Microsoft-Server would be the one running SQL-Server (1 Tier) and Navision Business logic (2nd Tier).
    Linux or Unix Clients with Opensource applications and a firefox browser as 3rt Tier to access Navision.

    Theoretically this is already possible today providing you spend a hell lot of time and effort to create the necessary xslt-sheets to access NAS. However, in a multi-user environment NAS would be the bottleneck. Only "one" client to handle all transactions.

    In fact we Do have a customer who tries to avoid Microsoft products wherever possible. Navision does not play a key role in this company. Nevertheless time is ripe to upgrade from 2.60D to 5.x ;)

    Providing a web-client-based solution certainly would be a killer criterium to buy the upgrade 8)
    With best regards from Switzerland

    Marcus Fabian
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    themavethemave Member Posts: 1,058
    This is only based on my own reasoning, since Microsoft has purchased Navision it has only changed it to require more integration with Microsoft products, with the goal of selling more server and office software, I can not see any instance where Microsoft would allow an upgrade that would let a customer use fewer Microsoft products.

    There will be no way you will be able to do away with Terminal server. maybe they will find a way to be able to get rid of Citrix but not Terminal server.

    Just my opinion anyways.

    David
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    WaldoWaldo Member Posts: 3,412
    Well, but that would be a strong selling point for NAV ... .

    The fact that NAV isn't still web based, means that you still have to use TS or Citris or Jetro or ... to work remote.

    When you would have the thin client on your laptop, and logging in in your database from the other side of the world, then you wouldn't have issues like "printing","zup-file",... PLUS ... the yearly license cost would not be spent on Citrix (NOT Microsoft), Jetro (NOT Microsoft) ... . I definitally see an advantage for Microsoft doing this ...

    Eric Wauters
    MVP - Microsoft Dynamics NAV
    My blog
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