Windows Vista Compatibility with MBS Navision 4.00

dohertyk
dohertyk Member Posts: 94
edited 2007-02-27 in NAV/Navision Classic Client
I was on MSDN, checking the threads there today and I was surprised when I ran across this URL.

http://forums.microsoft.com/MSDN/ShowPo ... D=1&mode=1

We have tried this at our company with the full release of Windows Vista(both the 64 bit and the 32 bit versions)

Does anyone have this working?

Our server runs MBS Navision 4.00 SP3.

The client we us is from Navision 4.00 SP3 as well.

Is there a trick to it (Compatibility mode)? Or is there something missing like an updated service pack for MBS Navision?

f you could refer me to a website or post a list of detailed instructions that would be great.

I reposted this information here, and modified it a bit then what it was on the MSDN website because I know the people here read/respond a whole lot faster.

Anxious for a response,

Kevin

Answers

  • Waldo
    Waldo Member Posts: 3,412
    There is a way to run SP2:
    http://www.mibuso.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=14410&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=30

    but no way (yet) you can run SP3.

    I expect Microsoft will have a solution for this shortly, but there is very few communication about this from MS.

    Eric Wauters
    MVP - Microsoft Dynamics NAV
    My blog
  • dohertyk
    dohertyk Member Posts: 94
    Waldo wrote:
    There is a way to run SP2:
    http://www.mibuso.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=14410&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=30

    but no way (yet) you can run SP3.

    I expect Microsoft will have a solution for this shortly, but there is very few communication about this from MS.

    Thank you for your reply Waldo,

    I understand what you are saying, and I appreciate the quickness of your reply. But that's a very risky proposition

    And may lead to problems with the database further down the road. I ran across that solution before on Stefano Demiliani's Blog site.

    And I also read it again on Kine's Blog (Kamil Sacek) as well. (http://msmvps.com/blogs/kine/archive/20 ... a-RC1.aspx)

    I don't know if I would recommend that solution to anyone.

    What has me excited is the previous posting in this thread that says that MBS Navision 4.00 will be supported under Windows Vista

    Even though version 3.70 is not. I am sure that there is an "official solution" out there that will allow us to have it working for us, and I just want to see what it is so that we can try it out.

    We would like to start some machines using Windows Vista, but we would find it hard to move forward if we are going to be held back by Windows Vista or MBS Navision.

    Still searching for a solution,

    Kevin
  • kine
    kine Member Posts: 12,562
    thread that says that MBS Navision 4.00 will be supported under Windows Vista

    Problem is the "will be" in the sentence. The servicepack (Vista compatibility update) for 4.xx will be released in two months after Vista public release. You need to wait for it. Now you can run only the SP2+update and if you want the SQL option, with the workaround I published. No other workarounds exists, because the problems lies deeply in finsql.exe, fin.exe and fin.stx and it is what you cannot change.
    Kamil Sacek
    MVP - Dynamics NAV
    My BLOG
    NAVERTICA a.s.
  • dohertyk
    dohertyk Member Posts: 94
    kine wrote:
    thread that says that MBS Navision 4.00 will be supported under Windows Vista

    Problem is the "will be" in the sentence. The servicepack (Vista compatibility update) for 4.xx will be released in two months after Vista public release. You need to wait for it. Now you can run only the SP2+update and if you want the SQL option, with the workaround I published. No other workarounds exists, because the problems lies deeply in finsql.exe, fin.exe and fin.stx and it is what you cannot change.

    Thank you Kamil for your response,

    Would you be kind enough to share where you get this information from?

    I am sure that you are correct when you say that a service pack will be out after Vista's public release.

    How is it that you can say that it will be within 2 months of Vista's public release?

    I hope that you are correct and Microsoft does something for Navision users everywhere, so that we can all use Navision under Windows Vista in the very near future.

    Thank you very much again.

    Kevin
  • pdj
    pdj Member Posts: 643
    dohertyk wrote:
    Would you be kind enough to share where you get this information from?
    I guess a lot of the information at Mibuso about next versions of NAV is hear-say originated from Microsoft employees when either attending conferences or when working with them on different projects. (Microsoft often get VAR consultants to assist them on different projects) I guess that all of the MVPs and a lot of the other "old" NAV boys and girls know a lot of people at Microsoft and get a lot information that way.

    But I guess the link below is the only "official" information about NAV and Vista that Microsoft have to offer:
    https://mbs.microsoft.com/partnersource ... page=false
    Microsoft officially wrote:
    Microsoft Dynamics NAV 4.0 Compatibility with Microsoft Dynamics Office 2007 and Windows Vista
    Last Modified 05-12-2006
    Posted 22-09-2006
    Microsoft Dynamics™ NAV is planning to support Microsoft Office 2007 including SharePoint Portal Server 2007 and Microsoft Windows Vista once they are available. Dynamics NAV development is currently working with the latest Release Candidates of Microsoft Office 2007 and Microsoft Windows Vista to ensure compatibility.

    Microsoft Office 2007 and Microsoft Windows Vista are not available today, and consequently Microsoft Dynamics NAV 4.0 does not support them. We will use the time until the availability of Microsoft Office 2007 and Microsoft Windows Vista to test and ensure compatibility with the final versions of Microsoft Office 2007 and Microsoft Windows Vista.

    When Dynamics NAV development has finalized testing, we will announce compatibility with Microsoft Office 2007 and Microsoft Windows Vista. We expect this to be within three month of the release of Microsoft Office 2007 and Microsoft Windows Vista respectively.
    Personally I guess they have decided to prioritize the planned release of NAV 5 above Vista support. Since the betas of Vista worked fine (IFAIK) I guess the NAV tech team has been fighting with some Vista tech teams about who is to blame about the problem :-) And since they already postponed the three-tier client to Q4 they won’t risk having to postpone even the basic C/Side client of NAV 5 as well. I think it is the right priority – the only problem is that they haven’t officially warned partners about the problem. Only partners reading Mibuso and other un-official forums know about the problems. This is a rather poor service in my opinion...
    Regards
    Peter
  • dohertyk
    dohertyk Member Posts: 94
    Thank you for the reply Peter,

    That's what my take is on Mibuso.. A lot of hear say, and I appreciate the link to Partner Source. Although I do a little bit of programming in Navision, I only have access to Customer Source, I am unable to actually view the link that you had included.

    Do you think any information will come out of Convergence regarding Windows Vista Compatibility?

    Or would you suspect that the focus would be on version 5.0 of the Client?

    I am unsure as to if I should be marking this as complete or if I should wait until after the conference. Maybe someone might be able to contribute more to this thread.

    Thanks once again for all your feedback, but for now I guess I will have to play the waiting game.

    Sincerely,

    Kevin
  • dohertyk
    dohertyk Member Posts: 94
    Today I was in a Microsoft Community Windows Chat with some "microsoft experts".

    I'll share with you the answer to a question that I asked.

    I'm sorry I can't elaborate more on it. But I wasn't able to have further follow up to it..

    Q: [51] Can no one answer my question Re: support for MBS Navision 4.00 under Windows Vista??

    A: Kevin - I see some internal information that states that MBS Navision 4.00 SP3 update 1 will run on Vista. There is also apparently a version 5.00 that is supported on Vista.

    So if someone knows, can they ask about when MBS Navision 4.00 SP3 Update 1 will be released? Or how you can go about it.

    Or if you can, can you post any of this "internal information"?

    Sincerely,

    Kevin
  • pdj
    pdj Member Posts: 643
    From: https://mbs.microsoft.com/partnersource ... ompatb.htm
    25-01-07 Microsoft officially wrote:
    In September 2006, we communicated that Microsoft Dynamics™ NAV 4.0 would be Microsoft Windows Vista and Microsoft Office 2007 compatible within 3 months after general availability of these Microsoft releases.

    Today, we are pleased to announce that Microsoft Dynamics NAV 4.0 SP3 and Microsoft Office 2007 are compatible immediately. This means that customers running on Microsoft Dynamics NAV 4.0 SP3 can take advantage of Microsoft Office 2007 without upgrading Microsoft Dynamics NAV 4.0 SP3.

    Expected Availability of Microsoft Dynamics NAV 4.0 SP3 and Microsoft Windows Vista Compatibility – February 16.

    We are pleased to announce the availability of a Platform Release for Microsoft Dynamics NAV 4.0 SP3 that will make Microsoft Dynamics NAV 4.0 SP3 compatible with Microsoft Windows Vista by February 16th.The Platform Release will enable Microsoft Dynamics NAV 4.0 SP3 customers to run on Microsoft Windows Vista.
    Microsoft Dynamics NAV 4.0 is not compatible with Microsoft Windows Vista when installed from the released CDs or downloads available from PartnerSource.

    To be able to run Microsoft Dynamics NAV 4.0 on Microsoft Windows Vista you will need to install Microsoft Dynamics NAV 4.0 SP3 and the platform roll-up update knowledge base article 931841

    Installation Guidelines
    You will need to make sure to have the following prerequisites in place before you can run Microsoft Dynamics NAV 4.0 SP3 on Vista:

    1. Install Microsoft Windows Vista
    2. Install Microsoft Dynamics NAV 4.0 SP3
    3. Search and Replace the Microsoft Dynamics NAV 4.0 SP3 Platform files with the ones in the updated System Requirements

    With this Platform Release the System Requirements has been updated too. You can find the updated System Requirements _here_.

    OMFG !!! (Sorry, I din't think I ever was to use that kind of language at Mibuso)
    The last link specifies the detailed requirements for the different modules.

    Vista is NOT going to be supported for native-DB Clients!!!! Only for the SQL clients. :evil:

    Atleast that's how I read it - I really hope I misunderstand it...
    The page contains a lot of tables, but I'll try to make a post of it here.
    Regards
    Peter
  • pdj
    pdj Member Posts: 643
    edited 2007-02-04
    This is extracted from https://mbs.microsoft.com/partnersource ... /Sysreq400
    Introduction wrote:
    Last Modified 26-01-2007
    Posted 28-04-2005

    An overview of the system requirements for Microsoft Dynamics NAV 4.0.
    System Requirements note: All recommendations are current at the time of document release and show the
    latest service packs for the required software. Microsoft Business Solutions supports the Microsoft Trustworthy
    Computing initiative and recommends you install and check for updated service packs as they help secure and
    stabilize your system. Service Packs may be found at http://www.microsoft.com/downloads.
    Secondly is a lot of tables with each NAV module specifying which operating systems they support and hardware resources.
    Everything supports Win 2000 and Win XP and Win 2003, and a few supports Small Business Server 2004, but Vista is a lacking a few critical places:
    NAV4 supported Operating Systems wrote:
    Vista supported
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Client (Microsoft SQL Server Option for Navision)
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Client (Single-User Installation)

    Vista NOT supported
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Client (Microsoft Dynamics NAV Database Server)
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Database Server (These system requirements are subject to change.)
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Application Server (NAV Database Server)
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Application Server (Microsoft SQL Server)
    I knew Microsoft would like to kill the Native DB, but I didn't expect Native customers ambushed like this...

    Edit: FALSE ALARM!!! Microsoft updated the system requirements Feb. 2nd, which I made a post about Feb. 4th.
    Regards
    Peter
  • David_Singleton
    David_Singleton Member Posts: 5,479
    pdj wrote:
    This is extracted from https://mbs.microsoft.com/partnersource ... /Sysreq400
    Introduction wrote:
    Last Modified 26-01-2007
    Posted 28-04-2005

    An overview of the system requirements for Microsoft Dynamics NAV 4.0.
    System Requirements note: All recommendations are current at the time of document release and show the
    latest service packs for the required software. Microsoft Business Solutions supports the Microsoft Trustworthy
    Computing initiative and recommends you install and check for updated service packs as they help secure and
    stabilize your system. Service Packs may be found at http://www.microsoft.com/downloads.
    Secondly is a lot of tables with each NAV module specifying which operating systems they support and hardware resources.
    Everything supports Win 2000 and Win XP and Win 2003, and a few supports Small Business Server 2004, but Vista is a lacking a few critical places:
    NAV4 supported Operating Systems wrote:
    Vista supported
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Client (Microsoft SQL Server Option for Navision)
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Client (Single-User Installation)

    Vista NOT supported
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Client (Microsoft Dynamics NAV Database Server)
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Database Server (These system requirements are subject to change.)
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Application Server (NAV Database Server)
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Application Server (Microsoft SQL Server)
    I knew Microsoft would like to kill the Native DB, but I didn't expect Native customers ambushed like this...

    WHAT! Is this real? As you say, this means the death of Navision Native as we know it. Once the simplicity is gone, what's the point.

    Its also 100% the opposite of what they said at Convergence.
    David Singleton
  • pdj
    pdj Member Posts: 643
    David Singleton wrote:
    WHAT! Is this real?
    That's the very good question. I take it you don't have access to PartnerSource?

    Well, at the page about Vista and NAV, it goes like this:
    With this Platform Release the System Requirements has been updated too. You can find the updated System Requirements here
    and on the page with system requirements:
    All recommendations are current at the time of document release and show the latest service packs for the required software.
    But this contradicts the first text, since the update is not released yet.

    That's how I read it - let's hope they clarify it soon.
    Regards
    Peter
  • kine
    kine Member Posts: 12,562
    In last few days I have problems with the Topic replay notifications, it is why I haven't react to your new info.

    For me it is very strange, that Single-user installation is supported and Nav DB client is not => It is still same client, just connecting remotely or directly - may be there are some problems with the TCPS connections to the Native DB server or with the firewall. But I think in case the single user mode is working, there will be no problem with the Native DB, but it is just hope.

    But I tested the NAV 4SP2+update 1 with Native DB Server running on another PC, and I was able to run client, connect to DB, work with DB. Of course, it is not like in live process, but it is working... :-)
    Kamil Sacek
    MVP - Dynamics NAV
    My BLOG
    NAVERTICA a.s.
  • Waldo
    Waldo Member Posts: 3,412
    imho,
    I think we are overreacting.
    I can't imagine that only SQL Server option will work. I think it will work, but may be it won't be supported by MS (and I agree, this is ridiculous).

    I already set up a database server on Vista, connected to it with the client (all SP2 off course), and all seems to be working (test environment), so why wouldn't it work with SP3, when the 'stx'-troubles are solved?

    :-k
    Let's wait until 16th of februari to judge this...

    Eric Wauters
    MVP - Microsoft Dynamics NAV
    My blog
  • pdj
    pdj Member Posts: 643
    Waldo wrote:
    I think we are overreacting.
    I sure hope so :-)
    Waldo wrote:
    I already set up a database server on Vista, connected to it with the client (all SP2 off course), and all seems to be working
    Just to clarify. Did you install the server and client on the same pc, or could you access the NAV-server from other Vista clients?

    Let's hope the system requirements are preliminary and updated upon release. [-o< (The sooner the better)
    Regards
    Peter
  • Waldo
    Waldo Member Posts: 3,412
    Both ... All is working.

    And remember, that SP2 is not supported by Vista either (referring to your list) :wink:

    Eric Wauters
    MVP - Microsoft Dynamics NAV
    My blog
  • Waldo
    Waldo Member Posts: 3,412
    Small remark ...

    I created an SP3 database under XP, copied it to Vista, and using the Developer's toolkit on that same SP3 database ... all works fine.

    (I already expected this to be working, because the only problems seems to be the exe's and the stx's...).

    Eric Wauters
    MVP - Microsoft Dynamics NAV
    My blog
  • KillerPM
    KillerPM Member Posts: 5
    So when MSFT says they are going to have a fix on Feb 16th, what are the chances its going to actually: a. be released on that date, and b. actually work for all people.

    basically I have to make the decision today to either buy the PC's with vista, or face a painful upgrade to vista later.

    I was hoping that they were going to have these issues hammered out when the official enterprise release date of vista was over a month ago. ](*,)
  • Waldo
    Waldo Member Posts: 3,412
    I find it's not a good idea to go for Vista ... it's never a good idea to go for a new platform, while it's not fully tested and supported by everything.
    It's not only NAV, it's also all the automations and other applications outside NAV that you'll have to deal with.

    And I can imagine you didn't have the chance to fully test it, so ... I wouldn't go for it for a production environment.

    Eric Wauters
    MVP - Microsoft Dynamics NAV
    My blog
  • pdj
    pdj Member Posts: 643
    Phew :-) The system requirements has been updated.
    NAV4 supported Operating Systems wrote:
    Vista supported
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Client (Microsoft SQL Server Option for Navision)
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Client (Single-User Installation)
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Client (Microsoft Dynamics NAV Database Server)

    Vista NOT supported
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Database Server (These system requirements are subject to change.)
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Application Server (NAV Database Server)
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Application Server (Microsoft SQL Server)
    =D>
    (But I agree with Waldo - don't plan to use it in a production enviroment from Feb. 17th.)
    Regards
    Peter
  • Waldo
    Waldo Member Posts: 3,412
    pdj wrote:
    Phew :-) The system requirements has been updated.
    NAV4 supported Operating Systems wrote:
    Vista supported
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Client (Microsoft SQL Server Option for Navision)
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Client (Single-User Installation)
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Client (Microsoft Dynamics NAV Database Server)

    Vista NOT supported
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Database Server (These system requirements are subject to change.)
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Application Server (NAV Database Server)
    >Microsoft Dynamics NAV Application Server (Microsoft SQL Server)
    =D>
    (But I agree with Waldo - don't plan to use it in a production enviroment from Feb. 17th.)

    hm,

    probably they'll change, because I tested all of it on Vista without problems.

    Ok, on a test system ... not in a production environment...

    Eric Wauters
    MVP - Microsoft Dynamics NAV
    My blog
  • Waldo
    Waldo Member Posts: 3,412
    Anyone found the Platform files for Sp3 on Vista yet?
    Still can't find them on Partnersource... :cry:

    Eric Wauters
    MVP - Microsoft Dynamics NAV
    My blog
  • KillerPM
    KillerPM Member Posts: 5
    Any news?

    Did a 4.0SP3 update come out today?
  • Waldo
    Waldo Member Posts: 3,412
    Nope, nothing to find yet ... .

    Eric Wauters
    MVP - Microsoft Dynamics NAV
    My blog
  • Alex_Chow
    Alex_Chow Member Posts: 5,063
    Just wait... MSFT isn't always that responsive when it comes to updating Partnersource.
    Confessions of a Dynamics NAV Consultant = my blog
    AP Commerce, Inc. = where I work

    Getting Started with Dynamics NAV 2013 Application Development = my book
    Implementing Microsoft Dynamics NAV - 3rd Edition = my 2nd book
  • Waldo
    Waldo Member Posts: 3,412
    They're working on a whole new concept regarding the Partnersource ... . Recently got some info on it ... sounds nice.

    Eric Wauters
    MVP - Microsoft Dynamics NAV
    My blog
  • ara3n
    ara3n Member Posts: 9,258
    Could you share the details?
    Ahmed Rashed Amini
    Independent Consultant/Developer


    blog: https://dynamicsuser.net/nav/b/ara3n
  • kine
    kine Member Posts: 12,562
    The Vista compatibility patch for NAV 4.00SP3 can be obtained from Microsoft, when you ask them for KB 931841.
    Kamil Sacek
    MVP - Dynamics NAV
    My BLOG
    NAVERTICA a.s.
  • KillerPM
    KillerPM Member Posts: 5
    kine wrote:
    The Vista compatibility patch for NAV 4.00SP3 can be obtained from Microsoft, when you ask them for KB 931841.

    Thanks, I was just going to ask about this.

    I am having my solution provider send that over to me right away.
  • dohertyk
    dohertyk Member Posts: 94
    KillerPM wrote:
    kine wrote:
    The Vista compatibility patch for NAV 4.00SP3 can be obtained from Microsoft, when you ask them for KB 931841.

    Thanks, I was just going to ask about this.

    I am having my solution provider send that over to me right away.

    ________________________________________
    From: MBS Knowledge Base [mailto:kbrfnmnt@microsoft.com]
    Sent: Monday, February 26, 2007 9:41 AM
    To: Kevin
    Subject: RE: Compatibility with Vista & Navision

    Kevin,

    The Microsoft Dynamics NAV 4.0 SP3 Platform Roll-up update (KB931841) is now available from Microsoft.

    To resolve this problem immediately, contact Technical Support for Microsoft Dynamics and related products to obtain the update. You can log on to the Microsoft Dynamics site and create a new support request. To do this, visit the following Microsoft Web site:
    https://mbs.microsoft.com/support/newstart.aspx

    KB 931841 should be edited and published today, but will not be available in the Knowledge Base until Tuesday or Wednesday.

    ________________________________________
    From: MBS Knowledge Base [mailto:kbrfnmnt@microsoft.com]
    Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2007 1:33 PM
    To: Kevin
    Subject: RE: Compatibility with Vista & Navision

    Kevin,

    This KB article is still in process and being tech reviewed. The service pack missed the mid-February release date that was forecasted. As of this morning, the service pack was not yet available.
    ________________________________________
    From: Kevin
    Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2007 11:12 AM
    To: MBS Knowledge Base
    Subject: Compatibility with Vista & Navision

    Hello,

    Can send me the files for KB 931841 regarding the article. I am unable to view this article or to get any of the attached file.

    Thanks in advance.
  • Waldo
    Waldo Member Posts: 3,412
    ara3n wrote:
    Could you share the details?

    Well, actually I don't have much details, just some quotes from our PAM.
    He told me they're working on:
    - a complete new way to obtain downloads, hotfixes, ... .
    - a new way to get everybody informed in time (Miklos?).
    - a new way to catagorise all the information ...
    - "a whole new partnersource"
    probably he exaggerated a bit :sick:

    Soit
    we didn't talk about it that much, but it was nice to know for me that they see there is a problem and they're working on it. :)

    Eric Wauters
    MVP - Microsoft Dynamics NAV
    My blog

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