Forms, Classic reports, Dataports and Classic database R.I.P

Michael_Nielsen_[MSFT]Michael_Nielsen_[MSFT] CopenhagenPosts: 47Member
edited 2012-07-25 in NAV Three Tier
Classic forms, reports and dataports has been around since 1995 and a lot of people (including me) has had a hard time understand that they will be gone in V7. In V7 they are replaced by more mordern concepts: Pages, RDL reports and XML-port, which will now include dataport functionality.

The classic runtime and database is also gone, which enables C/AL to run 100% managed on .net with full Unicode support for data.

C/SIDE is the only thing left in the classic client which has been renamed to "Dynamics NAV Development Environment"

We know that these are huge changes to Dynamics NAV and we are planning a number of readiness activities globally to make sure that you all get an opportunity the get up to speed with NAV 7 beafore the launch!

If you dont believe me - just take look at the attached screenshot from V7.:)

Michael
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.
«1

Comments

  • mohana_cse06mohana_cse06 Posts: 5,468Member
    Thanks Michael for the screenshot..

    I can see new object type called query..can you explain the use of it in a few words..
  • Luc_VanDyckLuc_VanDyck AartselaarPosts: 3,632Member, Moderator, Administrator
    Thx Michael for this information first hand. Hope you don't get into troubles now ;-)

    I don't like the completely absence of the "Form" object type, but I understand your reasons.
    No support using PM or e-mail - Please use this forum. || Search is your friend
    NAV TechDays 2019: 21 & 22 November 2019, Antwerp (Belgium)
  • Michael_Nielsen_[MSFT]Michael_Nielsen_[MSFT] CopenhagenPosts: 47Member
    I thought you would notice it Mohana:)

    We have not talked about Query in plublic yet and I cannot comment on it right now - but I left it in the screenshot for you to have something to look forward to on top of all the other goodies we still haven't talked about for V7

    Stay tuned!
    This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.
  • matttraxmatttrax Posts: 2,309Member
    I'm also interested in that new Codeunit 4 :D Don't suppose that's out of NDA yet?
  • Michael_Nielsen_[MSFT]Michael_Nielsen_[MSFT] CopenhagenPosts: 47Member
    codeunit 4 is part of our refactoring of codeunit 1, which had become a huge swiss army knife over time.
    This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.
  • BeliasBelias Posts: 2,993Member
    it's really kind that you show something to the community, just a little and moderated buzz around NAV 7 can do just good!
    now that we're talking about codeunit 1...what about making the system indicator "dynamic", without the need to close/reopen the client? It's a powerful feature that I (and i guess WE) want to ABuse! :whistle: :whistle: :whistle:
    (I don't want an answer, I'm just throwing an idea...I think you're busy enough with more relevant things before the release)
    Also, Have you ever thought about a "wishlist" webpage of nav 7, accessible to all customersource/partnersource accounts where we can suggest some new features etc? I know there's MS Connect, but we cannot post suggestions explicitly for the future releases.
    -Mirko-
    "Never memorize what you can easily find in a book".....Or Mibuso
    My Blog
  • davmac1davmac1 Posts: 1,277Member
    There are 2 form types that don't translate well to pages:
    1) Forms with a huge number of fields
    2) Dispatch boards

    As part of the pre-rollout, could you address solutions for these with RTC.
    Right now it seems that these types of forms will need to be moved to .net with a web services interface to NAV.
  • Michael_Nielsen_[MSFT]Michael_Nielsen_[MSFT] CopenhagenPosts: 47Member
    We have committed to read and prioritize all suggestions posted to MS connect, which is a lot of work and sucks up a lot of our PM’s bandwidth.

    We don’t want to create additional wish lists from our side since we will not be able to read/process/digest/respond on what has been suggested.

    However, we often look at iLoveNav, Mibuso and other sources for inspiration

    Michael
    This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.
  • Mark_BrummelMark_Brummel Posts: 4,262Member, Moderators Design Patterns
    Thanks for sharing this with the community Michael, I will blog a link to this post and and a tweet if you don't mind. :mrgreen:

    I can imagine that not everyone in the Dynamics worlds crawls this forum each day like we do.

    One question: Can you put the page button on the position where the form button used to be? 8)
  • SavatageSavatage Posts: 7,140Member
    "Michael wrote:
    "]will now include dataport functionality.

    Oooooh :mrgreen:
  • Alex_ChowAlex_Chow Posts: 5,063Member
    "Michael wrote:
    "]The classic runtime and database is also gone, which enables C/AL to run 100% managed on .net with full Unicode support for data.

    Does this mean we can have the Chinese version of NAV soon??? [-o<
  • MaciMaci Posts: 65Member
    Thanks for sharing, Michael!
    One question: Can you put the page button on the position where the form button used to be? 8)
    Yes! It would be very useful!
  • David_SingletonDavid_Singleton Posts: 5,454Member
    Maci wrote:
    Thanks for sharing, Michael!
    One question: Can you put the page button on the position where the form button used to be? 8)
    Yes! It would be very useful!


    Alt-G works no matter where the button is. :mrgreen:
    David Singleton
  • BlackTigerBlackTiger Posts: 1,212Member
    The classic runtime and database is also gone, which enables C/AL to run 100% managed on .net with full Unicode support for data.

    Prove it. Show me any SQL table design. :?
    "You can’t just ask customers what they want and then try to give that to them.
    By the time you get it built, they’ll want something new.” Steve Jobs
  • Mark_BrummelMark_Brummel Posts: 4,262Member, Moderators Design Patterns
    Does it help when I say that it works?

    All the fields are nVarChar in SQL now.

    Michael works with NAV since 1987 if I'm not mistaken, he's a techy like us, not a marketing guy. Trust him.
  • BlackTigerBlackTiger Posts: 1,212Member
    Ok, I believe you. :)

    What about ANSI->UTF convertion for existing data?
    "You can’t just ask customers what they want and then try to give that to them.
    By the time you get it built, they’ll want something new.” Steve Jobs
  • Mark_BrummelMark_Brummel Posts: 4,262Member, Moderators Design Patterns
    I don't want to break my NDA.

    All I can tell you, which is already over the line I guess, it that there is an automatic conversion to Unicode when you open a NAV6 database with a NAV7 runtime.

    I tested the upgrade toolkit for the guys in Vedbaek and so far my own little production database which I only use myself as a freelancer is running stable on NAV7 for several weeks now.

    Have faith!
  • BlackTigerBlackTiger Posts: 1,212Member
    BTW, no 'Run' for codeunits?... :-k
    Or just some UI bug?

    Unit testing must die? Only cowards are testing their code?
    "You can’t just ask customers what they want and then try to give that to them.
    By the time you get it built, they’ll want something new.” Steve Jobs
  • BlackTigerBlackTiger Posts: 1,212Member
    Oh wait... I understand why.

    There is no way to test your code anymore without running it in RTC... Not good... Moar headaches for some developers.
    "You can’t just ask customers what they want and then try to give that to them.
    By the time you get it built, they’ll want something new.” Steve Jobs
  • Mark_BrummelMark_Brummel Posts: 4,262Member, Moderators Design Patterns
    BlackTiger, please, calm down. This al works and has been taken care of.

    We share the same worries, but running codeunits, running tables, testing framework, it al works as expected.

    But yes, they all run in the RTC.
  • SogSog Posts: 1,023Member
    So the query object: don't take my word for it, but I think they are like stored procedures.
    Which means that creating a custom dataset for <insert your very own idea here> and communication for webservices, reporting, ... will be easier, letting us focus even more on the business instead of the connection/formatting/...
    Could this be confirmed when the NDA is passed?
    |Pressing F1 is so much faster than opening your browser|
    |To-Increase|
  • BlackTigerBlackTiger Posts: 1,212Member
    Actually 'Query' exists (kind of) in NAV for many years - known as "linked object".
    It's good to have it more integrated into NAV UI.

    Mark,

    Actually I care about "conditional formatting" for pages more than "Run" button :)
    Such feature would be much more useful (with some limits to prevent "LSD pages") than current useless hard-coded 'Style' property.
    "You can’t just ask customers what they want and then try to give that to them.
    By the time you get it built, they’ll want something new.” Steve Jobs
  • David_SingletonDavid_Singleton Posts: 5,454Member
    Sog wrote:
    So the query object: don't take my word for it, but I think they are like stored procedures.

    BlackTiger wrote:
    Actually 'Query' exists (kind of) in NAV for many years - known as "linked object".
    It's good to have it more integrated into NAV UI.

    Guys don';t speculate in this fashion. Making incorrect statements and stating them as though they are facts doesn't help the community. Unfortunately for NDA reasons, we can't even tell you you are wrong, or if maybe you have part of the idea, but not all of it.

    Part of the reason is that maybe these things are not finalized yet, and until they are, they wont be formerly announced.

    Unfortunately rumors like this are not good, and only cause problems when the product is finally released and does not work "the way you expected".
    David Singleton
  • Mark_BrummelMark_Brummel Posts: 4,262Member, Moderators Design Patterns
    I agree on the conditional formatting. This is a huge shortcomming in the RTC.
  • BlackTigerBlackTiger Posts: 1,212Member
    edited 2012-01-26
    There are not many meanings for the word "Query" in relation to DB based application. :)
    Unless MS will re-invent "query" like it's popular nowdays.
    "You can’t just ask customers what they want and then try to give that to them.
    By the time you get it built, they’ll want something new.” Steve Jobs
  • Michael_Nielsen_[MSFT]Michael_Nielsen_[MSFT] CopenhagenPosts: 47Member
    The reason "Run" was greyed out in the sceenshot is that I forgot to select a company:) Run will work like before, including running tabels - but with RTC instead of the classic client.

    I am sorry for the noise I created around query. The only thing I can say right now is that is will solve a lot of problems most of us had in the past. Think of something real nice and you will know what it will be like

    On the question on the forms which are not suitable for transforation to pages my suggestion is to look at the page extensibity model we introduced in R2. Usign web services will give you a lot of freedom to render things as you like - but takes up a lot of work and does not support modal dialogs.

    Ps! Based on Marks input we are looking at moving the page buttom back to the home of the old forms button
    This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.
  • Mark_BrummelMark_Brummel Posts: 4,262Member, Moderators Design Patterns
    "Michael wrote:
    "]...

    Ps! Based on Marks input we are looking at moving the page buttom back to the home of the old forms button

    Thanks for considering. \:D/
  • BlackTigerBlackTiger Posts: 1,212Member
    edited 2012-01-26
    :-#
    "You can’t just ask customers what they want and then try to give that to them.
    By the time you get it built, they’ll want something new.” Steve Jobs
  • AdministratorAdministrator Posts: 2,436Member, Moderator, Administrator
    BlackTiger wrote:
    Just a quick question.
    Is sub-page "current record" bug fixed? Or main form still calls subpage's function/action referencing it's first record instead of current?
    Don't abuse this topic to post all your bug-or-not-bug related questions you are facing! Please create another topic for these issues.
Sign In or Register to comment.